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BumRushDaShow

(157,287 posts)
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 05:30 AM Wednesday

Democrats play hardball on Epstein files

Source: The Hill

07/22/25 5:41 PM ET


Democrats are showing they’re ready to get dirty and hit President Trump where it hurts by stoking the Jeffrey Epstein controversy that’s severed his MAGA movement.

The strategy strays from the official line coming from top Democrats such as House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries (N.Y.), who say they want their midterm campaign message to center on Medicaid cuts and other kitchen-table policies contained in Trump’s “big, beautiful bill.”

But the focus on Epstein has also been remarkably successful, energizing the Democratic grassroots and aggravating tensions within the GOP.

And this week, it prompted Republican leaders to scrap their legislative plans and head early into the long summer recess — all to avoid votes on the Epstein saga. Even traditionalist Democratic veterans are applauding the tactic for its effectiveness.

Read more: https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5414628-democrats-hardball-epstein-files/

60 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Democrats play hardball on Epstein files (Original Post) BumRushDaShow Wednesday OP
Every single dem Hornedfrog2000 Wednesday #1
I think "by nature" BumRushDaShow Wednesday #3
Forgive my crassness... OldBaldy1701E Wednesday #5
Unfortunately BumRushDaShow Wednesday #7
When dealing with people... OldBaldy1701E Wednesday #11
As a Vulcan fan BumRushDaShow Wednesday #12
Indeed. OldBaldy1701E Wednesday #23
This is the problem of how they HAVE taught "history" - sanitized and white-washed BumRushDaShow Wednesday #24
Yes, it does. OldBaldy1701E Wednesday #30
I think the "problem" is that what is going on is magnified BumRushDaShow Wednesday #33
with all due respect Dyedinthewoolliberal Thursday #58
The beauty of this situation is that we don't need hearsay, etc., about anything pertaining to them. OldBaldy1701E Thursday #60
I'm a social worker so I'm all about being compassionate, empathetic and non confrontational but, choie Wednesday #19
My mom was a social worker before I was born (and then became a stay-at-home mom) BumRushDaShow Wednesday #21
AMEN. "...as people keep wanting "perfect" from the party, then they will only embolden the opposition." ancianita Wednesday #22
Hogg is doing everything possible to hurt turn out on our side creeksneakers2 Wednesday #39
One of my favorite voting analogies goes... electric_blue68 Wednesday #36
seems like these victims are all too often just a side note Skittles Wednesday #32
Totally true, but they do need to be careful so as to not overplay that hand, as the right always tends... the nelm Wednesday #35
Jeffries doesn't want to use Epstein ??? Boo !!! He better damn DAM well use it. If he doesnt, he needs to step down Trueblue1968 Wednesday #25
Remember the Old El Paso commercial BlueKota Wednesday #29
Who said Jeffries doesn't want to use it? creeksneakers2 Wednesday #40
All have to is READ original post. Didnt you read the paragraph that described what jefferies wants to concentrate on. Trueblue1968 Wednesday #52
It says center on other things creeksneakers2 Wednesday #53
They need proof first creeksneakers2 Wednesday #37
Before they can do that, the evidence has to be a smoking gun Polybius Wednesday #45
The ultimate kitchen-table policy Aviation Pro Wednesday #2
Absolutely Scott Alan Swaggerty Wednesday #50
I see the whole dynamic of Republicans and Democrats as the classic war between no_hypocrisy Wednesday #4
Why don't Democrats play hardball all the time??? N/T jimmil Wednesday #6
Because bagimin Wednesday #9
Democrats think that Republicans will reciprocate with the niceness---ROFLMAO! Bengus81 Wednesday #34
They are. creeksneakers2 Wednesday #41
repukes are treated like white men Skittles Thursday #57
All of this stuff coming out now makes me wonder about the recent "suicide" of... Trueblue Texan Wednesday #8
In this summer break I think it's essential to BELEAGUER republicans in their home districts. mpcamb Wednesday #10
Speaker Johnson can't know about Epstein Seinan Sensei Wednesday #13
Creepy!!! sdfernando Wednesday #14
Very creepy Scott Alan Swaggerty Wednesday #49
Can someone release nowforever Wednesday #15
"Even traditionalist Democratic veterans are applauding the tactic ..." Bluetus Wednesday #16
Just keep the pressure on and the help keep the story in the news Torchlight Wednesday #17
Every time a Democrat is interviewed they should bring up Epstein first then privot and answer the kimbutgar Wednesday #18
They really should Scott Alan Swaggerty Wednesday #48
Jeffries doesn't think Dems are capable of focusing on more than one issue? choie Wednesday #20
Where did Jeffries say that? creeksneakers2 Wednesday #42
The OP posted a quote from The Hill choie Wednesday #55
That says center on the Medicaid cuts creeksneakers2 Wednesday #56
I think the attempt is to underscore BumRushDaShow Thursday #59
About fucking time and this is important Blue Owl Wednesday #26
No compromise with a child rapist, or someone protecting child rapists! OrlandoDem2 Wednesday #27
Indeed Scott Alan Swaggerty Wednesday #47
Hardball? ILikePie92 Wednesday #28
Another supporter of lies creeksneakers2 Wednesday #43
Ha ILikePie92 Wednesday #51
What could they do that they aren't doing? creeksneakers2 Wednesday #54
"democrats play hardball" haydukelives Wednesday #31
I'm a Dem who always thought there were times to play hardball! To e Very Assertive, and pointed.... electric_blue68 Wednesday #38
Hardball? Aussie105 Wednesday #44
Kick Scott Alan Swaggerty Wednesday #46

Hornedfrog2000

(404 posts)
1. Every single dem
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 06:47 AM
Wednesday

Should be demanding the pedophile n chief be arrested for being a pedophile.

But, they wont. We will continue to watch them be too soft.

BumRushDaShow

(157,287 posts)
3. I think "by nature"
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 07:04 AM
Wednesday

Democrats are "caring", "empathetic", and try to be "non-confrontational" in their effort to solve everyday problems. And those in the populace who are also like that, gravitate towards supporting this approach.

But with politics being a nasty business, you DO have some who can and do get down into the mud to fight it out. However what tends to happens is that when they do, they often get pushback from some "loud" corners, so it's often hard to find those capable of striking the right "balance".

OldBaldy1701E

(8,466 posts)
5. Forgive my crassness...
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 07:47 AM
Wednesday

And my language...

But, fuck 'balance'.

As Kevin Costner said to the judge in the movie 'The Untouchables'...

"`I have forsworn myself. I have broken laws I swore to defend. I've become what I beheld and I'm content I have done right.'"

We might remember that this can be the reality of the situation sometimes.

BumRushDaShow

(157,287 posts)
7. Unfortunately
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:04 AM
Wednesday

that is the "human nature" of things.

There is obviously a transition underway but people need to understand the psychology of individuals and sociology of groups, and how they handle calamitous change.

OldBaldy1701E

(8,466 posts)
11. When dealing with people...
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:23 AM
Wednesday

It is probably for the best to remember that we are humans, and as such are prone to be more into the 'human nature' of things.

Appealing to logic and reason is fine, but, also unfortunately, we are not Vulcans. (Even though I know a few people who would pass for one.)

BumRushDaShow

(157,287 posts)
12. As a Vulcan fan
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:29 AM
Wednesday

I would agree. But then we know the background and nature of Vulcans and why they chose the path that they did.

Their inherent nature hasn't changed but is masked by rigid training and discipline.

OldBaldy1701E

(8,466 posts)
23. Indeed.
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 03:02 PM
Wednesday

One has to wonder if we humans would be capable of such a transformation.

Yes, but I won't see it if it does come to pass. We have a long way to go to become that self-aware. Too many of us believe that such awareness is an affront to their way of life. They'd rather see it all destroyed than have to face that music.

It is very sad. It is not the United States that I was taught about in school, nor is it the one that all of my hippie family members and older friends tried to create. It isn't even the one that Hollywood would have you believe it is.

BumRushDaShow

(157,287 posts)
24. This is the problem of how they HAVE taught "history" - sanitized and white-washed
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 03:42 PM
Wednesday

What is going right now is nothing new.



Millard Fillmore was down there in the basement of Presidents along with his own "in the bag" Chief Justice - the horrid Roger "Dred Scott" Taney (just like 45 and Roberts).



This country goes through these "cycles".

OldBaldy1701E

(8,466 posts)
30. Yes, it does.
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 07:06 PM
Wednesday

History shows it.

However, it is tough to lean on history when people are staring into the abyss. Knowing that times will get better in 20-76 years does not really do much for me, ya know? I am more worried about making it through each day while trying to make as little of an impact on our finances as I can. Which, with my failing body, is all but impossible.

The problem with history is that it sanitizes the reality of what transpired to create it. To be honest, I never wanted to be a statistic in the service of some fascist regime.

But, I never wanted to be a statistic in the service of a capitalistic regime either, so...

BumRushDaShow

(157,287 posts)
33. I think the "problem" is that what is going on is magnified
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 07:25 PM
Wednesday

literally by the availability of "instant, as it's happening" technology - radio, TV, internet. It ends up allowing a "mass experience" of both good and bad events, literally in "real time".

A perfect "historical" example of what "lack of immediacy" resulted in is the very origin of "Juneteenth", where the Emancipation Proclamation was signed in 1863 and the people in Galveston, TX didn't "get the memo" until 2 years later.

I think this requires people to try to cope or tune out in some way, and many do (which when it comes to things like the encroachment of fascism, is what they want to happen - less "engagement" and thus they power on). All of these types of systems eventually fall - but agree that the wait is horrible, especially if you or your family/friends/neighbors are directly impacted.

But people who experienced it do pass that info on to the next generation. I have posted this before, but (as a Trek reference too ), George Takei had a recent interview to describe his time in several internment camps during WW2 -

Dyedinthewoolliberal

(16,139 posts)
58. with all due respect
Thu Jul 24, 2025, 12:38 AM
Thursday

that is dialogue from a movie so it's not really a strategy. Having said that the D's need to get a few of the members to take on the role of 'bad cop' and blister his hide on a daily basis using FACTS, not hearsay, rhetoric or wishful thinking.

OldBaldy1701E

(8,466 posts)
60. The beauty of this situation is that we don't need hearsay, etc., about anything pertaining to them.
Thu Jul 24, 2025, 10:32 PM
Thursday

The truth is the 'big gun' here.

But, yes, there needs to be something along the lines of an 'attack squad', who dig into them constantly across whatever platform they can manage.

As to strategy, the idea behind that metaphor (the dialogue you mentioned) was to suggest that maybe we stop worrying about being 'couth' and using 'good form', and start worrying about being 'lax' in our efforts to go after them, as opposed to being on the defensive the majority of the time. (There is also a bit of 'history is written by the victors' vibe in that quote, but we will save that one for another time. Heh.)

choie

(5,881 posts)
19. I'm a social worker so I'm all about being compassionate, empathetic and non confrontational but,
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 01:32 PM
Wednesday

how about being compassionate and empathetic to trump and epstein's victims, not to mention our country. Justice matters, and offenders should not be president. If Dems are being non confrontational, they're not doing their job.

BumRushDaShow

(157,287 posts)
21. My mom was a social worker before I was born (and then became a stay-at-home mom)
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 02:04 PM
Wednesday

So she would tell us about some of her past cases - including those adults and children who were institutionalized (this was when she was working back in the '50s).

There was quite a lot featured about Epstein's victims but at least one was pressured to drop her case and others tried to press their cases.

E.g., there was a docuseries done about them - https://apnews.com/article/jeffrey-epstein-entertainment-crime-arrests-featured-61d4fe425a7526f46218393912f45051

It was done for Lifetime Channel - https://www.mylifetime.com/shows/surviving-jeffrey-epstein

But the kicker here is that after what happened in 2019 with Epstein and Maxwell, then what happened? A pandemic that killed over 1 million here in the U.S. alone, so that shoved everything to the background.

But just like what happened with Sean "P-Diddy" Combs, you have forces that interfere with victims rights. As it is, you have people like Gaetz still running around. As long as men "run the show" then it will be like this.

And with respect to Democrats - they have run up against the Roberts Supreme Court, which has coddled and supported 45 for a long time.

There is that saying about "elections have consequences" and as long as people keep wanting "perfect" from the party, then they will only embolden the opposition.

ancianita

(41,174 posts)
22. AMEN. "...as people keep wanting "perfect" from the party, then they will only embolden the opposition."
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 02:58 PM
Wednesday

We mustmust support our youth demographic and not be divided by corporate driven hype against Mamdani or Hogg or anyone else who are raising GOTV numbers.

creeksneakers2

(7,719 posts)
39. Hogg is doing everything possible to hurt turn out on our side
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 09:04 PM
Wednesday

Polls showed the reason we lost youth turnout was because they thought we weren't doing enough to stop Trump. Hogg pushes the message constantly that Dems don't stand to Trump. The exact thing that hurt us last time with the young. That's why the Heritage Foundation loves him.

And he never says what Dems should actually do, other than to offer some lethally unpopular extremist policy suggestions like defunding the the police. We can't stop Trump with Congress because we don't have the votes. The courts work at lower levels but the Supremes are crooked and in Trump's pocket. Making public statements has limited effect because half the country is brainwashed.

Democrats are doing all they can. We'll do better if Hogg and his followers help Democrats instead of the GOP.

https://www.projectveritas.com/news/part-two-dnc-leader-david-hogg-slams-pelosis-too-well-timed-stock-trades

electric_blue68

(22,656 posts)
36. One of my favorite voting analogies goes...
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:52 PM
Wednesday

You don't have to fall innlove w a candidate.
Voting is like travel. You take the bus that gets you closest to you destination.

This drive for "the perfect", instead of "the good" has gotten us , "the horrific"!!

FU, voters who stayed home ! You had NO EXCUSE! None! You saw what he was like First Term. What were you thinking?! Arrrggg! Blarghhh!

Skittles

(166,311 posts)
32. seems like these victims are all too often just a side note
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 07:24 PM
Wednesday

the talk about political leverage regarding this issue is just plain sickening, this is NOT A GAME

the nelm

(126 posts)
35. Totally true, but they do need to be careful so as to not overplay that hand, as the right always tends...
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:26 PM
Wednesday

to do. Don't give the opposition the ammo they need to turn to turn this back on themselves (the Dems) as Trump and Johnson are trying to do. Be strategic with the kill shots. This is not to say play nice or anything like that, just wait for the openings the Repubs and press give you, then strike hard. Does that make sense?

Trueblue1968

(18,649 posts)
25. Jeffries doesn't want to use Epstein ??? Boo !!! He better damn DAM well use it. If he doesnt, he needs to step down
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 04:48 PM
Wednesday

Money, health insurance, tax cuts etc are all great things to run campaigns on. BUT Epstein and Trump and the rest of them sexually and violently attached
Children. One of the victims I. Her 40's committed suicide because she

BlueKota

(4,433 posts)
29. Remember the Old El Paso commercial
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 06:33 PM
Wednesday

where the little girl said "why not both?", when debating food choices.

Use both the cuts and the scandals against the cult backers in power. We have a lot of intelligent people in our party, who are more than capable of walking and chewing gum at the same time. There are also members on our side, who aren't afraid to take the bullies to task. If leadership doesn't want to do it, hand the mikes over to those that do. There are times playing nice is an effective strategy, and times where it's doomed to failure. We are in the later stage.

Trueblue1968

(18,649 posts)
52. All have to is READ original post. Didnt you read the paragraph that described what jefferies wants to concentrate on.
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 11:18 PM
Wednesday

creeksneakers2

(7,719 posts)
37. They need proof first
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:52 PM
Wednesday

But that didn't stop you from attacking Democrats instead of Republicans. Whose side are you on?

Polybius

(20,600 posts)
45. Before they can do that, the evidence has to be a smoking gun
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 09:28 PM
Wednesday

Don't get me wrong, he's almost certainly guilty. However, posing with Epstein, attending his parties, writing him birthday letters, and even riding on his plane isn't enough to call for his arrest. All of the above is legal. What they can do is try and see if there's undeniable evidence that he slept with underage girls.

no_hypocrisy

(52,387 posts)
4. I see the whole dynamic of Republicans and Democrats as the classic war between
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 07:37 AM
Wednesday

Narcissists and Empaths respectively.

Empaths take a lot of abuse, not because they're masochistic. They don't enjoy or appreciate the harm inflicted upon them and their constituents. They use compassion, understanding, and (to a certain extent) confusion when they should be showing they won't be dominated. Arguments almost seem like a waste of time because the Narcissists/Republicans aren't interested and aren't listening.

And Narcissists regale in their ability to prevail without being stopped or held in account for their damage, their words, etc.

And like Samson in The Old Testament, while stripped of his hair and his strength, and chained to wheel, the Narcissists/Philistines fail to notice that his hair has started to grow back, restoring his strength.

And Democrats are now ready to assert control against their adversaries, who used to be compatriots in Congress.

Whether it's Epstein or it's the shock and awe of Democrats rising up on their hind legs, being relentless, and being heard, it's working.

Bengus81

(9,079 posts)
34. Democrats think that Republicans will reciprocate with the niceness---ROFLMAO!
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 07:35 PM
Wednesday

Republicans laughed their assess off as Al Franken was tossed under the bus by a load of Dems. Now we have a fucking NAZI who ignores laws,the rules of Congress and the Constitution.

Anyone see a load of Republicans racing to get Trump out of office?? Their like Trump,school yard bullies. Time to stop fucking around with them and show them some muscle.

Skittles

(166,311 posts)
57. repukes are treated like white men
Thu Jul 24, 2025, 12:25 AM
Thursday

Dems are treated like women and POC - our anger is used AGAINST us

Trueblue Texan

(3,526 posts)
8. All of this stuff coming out now makes me wonder about the recent "suicide" of...
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:07 AM
Wednesday

Virginia Guiffre. She won a settlement from Prince Andrew after fighting for justice for years, yet in April she committed suicide. I wonder about the circumstances of that.

mpcamb

(3,131 posts)
10. In this summer break I think it's essential to BELEAGUER republicans in their home districts.
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:12 AM
Wednesday

They look terrible for what they're doing.
Keep the pressure on. Don't let it wither.

Seinan Sensei

(1,079 posts)
13. Speaker Johnson can't know about Epstein
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 08:33 AM
Wednesday

Because his teenage son, his “accountability partner,” won’t allow Johnson to view anything lewd or pornographic.

sdfernando

(5,826 posts)
14. Creepy!!!
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 10:13 AM
Wednesday

This is one of the creepiest father/son relationships I've ever heard of! That kid is going to have issues when he becomes and adult.

nowforever

(574 posts)
15. Can someone release
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 10:44 AM
Wednesday

the birthday message, it is literally a confession on the joys of pedophilia...

Bluetus

(1,341 posts)
16. "Even traditionalist Democratic veterans are applauding the tactic ..."
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 11:03 AM
Wednesday

Now there is some serious damning with faint praise.

Let me translate: Even the empty suit Democrats who have prevented us from taking aggressive, populist positions on ANYTHING for 45 years of trickle-down economics and the dismantling of much of what the FDR years built, are now acknowledging, ever so meekly and privately, that maybe it has been a mistake to not oppose these fascists for over two generations.

I'd like to say "Welcome aboard, better late than never". But they aren't really aboard and it may be too late.

Torchlight

(5,191 posts)
17. Just keep the pressure on and the help keep the story in the news
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 11:04 AM
Wednesday

The rest (I think) is dominoes.

kimbutgar

(25,642 posts)
18. Every time a Democrat is interviewed they should bring up Epstein first then privot and answer the
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 01:32 PM
Wednesday

Question about the subject but mention this Epstein thing should be front and center.

choie

(5,881 posts)
20. Jeffries doesn't think Dems are capable of focusing on more than one issue?
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 01:35 PM
Wednesday

That's lazy and cowardly.

creeksneakers2

(7,719 posts)
42. Where did Jeffries say that?
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 09:11 PM
Wednesday

"Last week, Jeffries convened his committee leaders and other key Democrats with a message: “Keep the pressure on,” he told them, according to people privy to his closed-door instructions."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/house-dems-find-their-mojo-with-the-epstein-saga/ar-AA1J7Mm9

choie

(5,881 posts)
55. The OP posted a quote from The Hill
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 11:39 PM
Wednesday

"The strategy strays from ]the official line coming from top Democrats such as House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries (N.Y.), who say they want their midterm campaign message to center on Medicaid cuts and other kitchen-table policies contained in Trump’s “big, beautiful bill.”

creeksneakers2

(7,719 posts)
56. That says center on the Medicaid cuts
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 11:51 PM
Wednesday

Doesn't say not to use Epstein. Did you miss the headline?

"Democrats play hardball on Epstein files"

BumRushDaShow

(157,287 posts)
59. I think the attempt is to underscore
Thu Jul 24, 2025, 04:31 AM
Thursday

that there should be an agenda beyond "anti-45", so remember to focus on Medicaid and other service cuts, as well as the GOP's intentional flaunting of the law, but use the Epstein atrocity to keep the GOP back on their heels, and obstruct their craven actions of slashing and burning down the country.

Blue Owl

(56,802 posts)
26. About fucking time and this is important
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 05:13 PM
Wednesday

Pedophilia is a whole different arena than any other sex scandal involving adults — its predatory, sickening, and revolting in every aspect.

electric_blue68

(22,656 posts)
38. I'm a Dem who always thought there were times to play hardball! To e Very Assertive, and pointed....
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 09:02 PM
Wednesday

Last edited Thu Jul 24, 2025, 12:23 AM - Edit history (1)

I used to design quite assertive letter sized posters on conputer which I'd xerox, and paste up on bus stop structures by college campuses, my neighbors, and maybe midtown, too.

Aussie105

(7,113 posts)
44. Hardball?
Wed Jul 23, 2025, 09:26 PM
Wednesday

Last edited Wed Jul 23, 2025, 10:38 PM - Edit history (1)

What I both understand and find strange:

I understand that males often get together to make up a group, and their own rules can go against those of society.
Examples?
Three lads out and about come across a single female at a bus stop, drag her into the bushes and rape her.
Motorcycle gangs where entry is favouring a certain brand, have a strict code regarding dress and facial hair, and deal in drugs.
etc

Once you are in a group/gang, you make up your own rules and code speak, and rules of legality and morality just aren't relevant.
Seems to be the nature of the male part of humanity.

What I find strange:
Society and the law say 'not so fast' and crack down on gangs.
Now comes the clincher:
A gathering of males who decide that a hunt for fresh meat in a predatory and sexual way is just dandy.
These males are also 'important' in a business, financial and political sense.

And the police, the legal system go hands-off, we aren't going there!

Reminds me of this story:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65878077
"Berlusconi, the belly dancer and the bunga bunga parties"

At the time I thought . . . Italian politics? Self entitled, corrupt, decadent gang of old blokes.
Couldn't possibly happen in a civilized country!
Guess I was wrong.

Berlusconi almost did 4 years in prison for tax evasion.
His history and Trump's have many similarities.

Hopefully Trump will go the same way, tax evasion is the least of his crimes but the easiest to prove.


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