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The Traveler

(5,632 posts)
28. I think you are right
Fri Jan 24, 2014, 02:05 PM
Jan 2014

And I think Sinclair's quote applies here with very little additional interpretation.

And I have to admit (as a male with a long association with the military, and its corresponding impact on my linguistic habits) that I am quite guilty of that linguistic pattern. This, despite the fact that I am (and have long been) aware of the pattern you describe and its detrimental effects.

Language really is important. It is not merely a means of expressing thought and feeling ... it is a tool for developing thought and feeling. And one's language patterns are very much a matter of training and habit ... and thus are a reflection of how the mind itself has been trained.

These very detrimental patterns of thought and speech are NOT easily disarmed, even by those of us who are aware of the problem and disapprove of it. It would help to have linguistic elements that are invective and which can be used to convey thought and feeling in situations where one man must criticize another. I have been told by a Chief Petty Officer that, when I am confronted with that sort of situation, my use of language causes seasoned naval sailors to blush and flee. (He intended that as a compliment, BTW.)

For example, I regard Paul Ryan as an incomplete and largely dysfunctional male (like most Randians). He is untrustworthy. He deliberately de-magnetized his moral compass decades ago. He is self centered, and panders to a certain element in order to achieve personal power. He is incapable of exerting personal courage or committing to sacrifice to achieve the greater good. He is not someone with whom I would seek an honest intellectual debate, for I do not believe him to be capable of intellectual honesty. He is certainly not someone I would ever want at my shoulder when on the field of battle, for his commitment to Randian "self interest" is likely to compel him to leave my butt exposed when the evil wind is up. Etc.

Now, I can express all of that in a fashion any other male can understand, and with great force, and a very few words ... but those words reinforce the pattern you describe and serves to promote male privilege and even misogyny. (An alternative set of words slurs the LGBT folk ... it's a similar problem.)

So I need new words and turns of phrase that are both easily expressed and readily understood ... and which pack emotional force ... for moments where I just have to express all that tersely and and effectively. (During my study of Soviet culture back in the 80s, I learned that the word (if I remember aright) "nikulturny" ... which means "without culture" ... was one of the most deadly insults in the repertoire. Pretty much guaranteed to produce a bar fight. What a great word ... but it draws a blank stare when used here, of course. And no one seems to care about being called uncultured.)

Change the use of language, you change the underlying patterns of thought, and vice-versa. This all takes time. Consequently I have chosen to resort to suppression of the impulse to use that sexist nomenclature. In that effort, I am not always successful, and so must ask the indulgence and forgiveness of those who I unintentionally offend.

Trav

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Deep and ingrained but, you explained Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #1
Thanks. redqueen Jan 2014 #2
You know, I think his quote definitely can work here too. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #3
Thanks redqueen Jan 2014 #5
But, what if women were... TreasonousBastard Jan 2014 #4
I'm not following you. redqueen Jan 2014 #6
I'm not sure what unrelated historical inaccuracies.. TreasonousBastard Jan 2014 #14
You find it's best to ignore them? Is that supposed to mean something? redqueen Jan 2014 #18
Yes. And it means they do the job... TreasonousBastard Jan 2014 #20
Yeah. Words mean little. That's totally doubleplus true. redqueen Jan 2014 #22
You have a lot of nerve to come into a protected group and tell us to ignore Sheldon Cooper Jan 2014 #24
Well, I do agree with you in this cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #7
But 'don't throw like a girl' and 'be a man' are both phrases denigrating to women Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #8
They imply that they should "be real men" what ever that is cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #9
You do have a point... TreasonousBastard Jan 2014 #15
I tend you agree with you in the last point. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #25
I agree that the glorification of strength and power have become obsolete. But how Squinch Jan 2014 #13
What if women are actually superior? ismnotwasm Jan 2014 #16
Superior at what? I don't... TreasonousBastard Jan 2014 #17
"For some reason buried in prehistory...we tend to celebrate males". No. redqueen Jan 2014 #19
I don't see any point in continuing to participate in this thread. TreasonousBastard Jan 2014 #21
Since you're basically insisting that language has nothing to do with oppression, redqueen Jan 2014 #23
I could link to a dozen papers and it still wouldn't do any good ismnotwasm Jan 2014 #29
Yeah, I wasn't even going to go there. redqueen Jan 2014 #31
What do you mean 'if'. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #26
Heh! ismnotwasm Jan 2014 #30
I think it's both funny and sad that you have to put a "HOF Thread" warning in the title. Sheldon Cooper Jan 2014 #10
Heh, yeah... I just didn't want to attract any anti-feminist input. redqueen Jan 2014 #11
Me too. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #12
I really don't understand why so many men are such amuse bouche Jan 2014 #27
It's just part of our culture. redqueen Jan 2014 #32
I think you are right The Traveler Jan 2014 #28
"Change the use of language, you change the underlying patterns of thought, and vice-versa." redqueen Jan 2014 #33
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